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GM Foods on the Attack in Europe

by: Asinus Asinum Fricat

Wed Feb 11, 2009 at 16:53:19 PM PST


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A really bad cold can not stem my anger at the various GM Biotechs who are now playing us like fools as they are unashamedly portraying themselves as the White Knights of the modern world. Last June I wrote here:

In the face of climate chaos and a deepening world food crisis, the Gene mongers are gearing up for a PR offensive to re-brand themselves as climate saviors, pushing genetically engineered crops as a silver bullet solution to climate change.


Well it has come even though green campaigners and politicians alike have expressed concerns that the long-term safety of GM crops has not been established scientifically or otherwise.
Asinus Asinum Fricat :: GM Foods on the Attack in Europe
I am not completely against Biotechs particularly when it comes to the discovery of the rust "avirulence gene" which could result in the development of new wheat varieties with improved and longer lasting rust resistance among other things, no, I am against proprietary control freaks on the one hand and the fact that a broad consensus among the scientific world demands that the environmental effects of genetically modified plants should be evaluated using science-based assessment procedures before jumping the gun. And what about the animals? How will they react to feeds from genetically modified crops and enzymes derived from genetically modified micro-organisms? There are so many more questions and so few answers.

Yet a major UK supermarket chain, Tesco, is happily leading the charge extolling the wonders of GM:

Tesco chief executive Sir Terry Leahy has signaled that the retailer is willing to back genetically modified (GM) foods, saying consumer attitudes have changed and it has a vital part to play. Speaking at the annual City Food Lecture, held in London, Leahy said: "In some ways it may have been a failure of us all actually to stand behind the science.
You get a sense that whilst always the scientific evidence was clear, governments let alone retailers stopped short of wholehearted endorsing it and I think that that certainly didn’t help in the case of GM."
Whoopee do! Let's put the horse before the cart!

For the last six months I've been hearing noises from the GM lobby planting doubt in the minds of consumers and made some notes:

A genetically modified variety of spud may have to be produced in Irish laboratories because of the growing threat from blight.


And this:

Dr Ewen Mullins, a research officer with Teagasc, the agriculture and food development authority, said the risk of blight has become more serious in the past two years.


Currently, according to Irish data, potato farmers have to spray their crops up to 12 times a year. But now we're told that there is hope to create a variety that will only need to be sprayed four times a year. The decreased use of pesticides would in turn mean less damage to the environment. Ha! The environment...and the -carrot- cost:

"If we were to reduce chemicals by up to 40% on our potato crop, that would challenge potato growers. We [think] GM is worth investigating from that point of view. GM seed costs more and it comes down to choice".
Note the hesitation.


In the EU the GM debate has gone on for more than 15 years, yet the GM lobby is quoted yesterday as saying: It is timely to have the debate. Then here comes the noble knights:
Amid rising food insecurity where food manufacturers face volatile commodity prices and supply issues, GM crops have been promoted as a way of helping to ease a food crisis.


Because of public concern over the risk associated with their co-existence alongside non-GM crops, Brussels is still investigating the environmental impact of a number of GM crops and whether they could provide an economic benefit to farmers via reduced chemical costs.

Let's bring in a Lord for good measure and a tad of credence:
Lord Krebs, former chairman of the UK Food Standards Agency, who also joined the panel agreed and said: "To me the real moral tragedy of the whole GM debacle was not so much the impact on our food here in the UK, but the fact that the European prissiness about GM has affected its adoption in Africa."
Ha! The African card is played, the poor are malnourished because of that pesky GM resistance. Never mind the environment.


Europeans on average consume about 107kg of spuds a year. With world food prices soaring, experts think increased consumption of spuds could be the answer to shortages because they are easy to grow, quick to mature, require little water and have much higher yields than wheat or rice.

The Irish view: there is still much hostility in Ireland to GM crops. In 1998, campaigners sabotaged a GM sugar-beet crop in Co Wexford, part of a trial by Monsanto, an American company. Others attacked a GM trial plot at Oak Park. Last year another chemical firm, BASF, abandoned plans to grow GM potatoes in Ireland, moving its research operations to Britain. The company had been given approval for field trials in Co Meath.

If you visit Monsanto website, it's all good, the world now grows 282.4 million acres (114.3 million hectares) of GM crops (2007 figures) from 12 million farmers in 23 countries. Not a worry.

OrangeClouds115 and many others have done numerous diaries on why organics are in a much better position to feed the world without having to subscribe to the notion of a chemically induced environment. I know some of you think we are naysayers and fearmongers but ask yourself this: would you prefer to live in a world free of chemical pesticides and eat organically grown meats and vegetables or risk the unknown?
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Nice post, thanks! (4.00 / 4)
Too bad I have a damned headache now from dealing with that shill / hack over at GOS.

"Indian farmers lust after GM crops"?

Yeah, when they're not committing suicide...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


headache? me too!! (4.00 / 4)
Superb essay AAF!
thank you
♥~

g'nite jay!



come firefly-dreaming with me....


[ Parent ]
Tell me about it... (4.00 / 4)
It's like arguing with pavement; only pavement's more open-minded and likelier to admit when it's wrong...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

[ Parent ]
At least we got the trolls out in numbers....and if you notice, it's (4.00 / 4)
always the same ones that come out and spout their bile. Paid hacks! I'm doing a little search on usernames to see if I can come up with something. It strikes me as strange that we get trounced on by the same lot, there's a pattern in this.

Sic Transit Gloria Locavore!



[ Parent ]
I think that means... (4.00 / 4)
we're doing our job.  Notice they're becoming more and more unhinged these days?

They're also largely the same ones who rabidly defend the industrial food system, too.

One of them (murraywv or something like that...) actually showed up in one of my early PCA salmonella diaries at dKos and insinuated that I was a "conspiracy theorist".

Yeah.  I was proven wrong on that one, eh!  Lol...

I swear, a few of them might as well hold a patent on "Being WrongTM".  If these are our scientists, no wonder everything's so fucked up these days...

Funny that another one also brought up salmonella in your diary yesterday, while only mentioning small farms and raw milk producers.  I'm sorry, but has she seen any headlines from over the past 2 months?  Really wanna talk about salmonella poisoning?  She abandoned that line pretty quickly.  Fail!  Lol...

It is the same very vocal, but very small group.  I've noticed maybe 3 or 4, but I'm sure there are a few more.  

If they admit they're wrong, their whole world will fall apart.  They're fundamentalists by definition.  

They're terrified of things they can't control.  Nature scares them out of their wits...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
That's Rumsfeld territory! Remember him? (4.00 / 4)
If they admit they're wrong, their whole world will fall apart.  They're fundamentalists by definition.


Sic Transit Gloria Locavore!



[ Parent ]
Yeah... (4.00 / 4)
Tried to forget, though.

Very quotable.  He's like an Evil Yogi Berra, heh...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
did you know (4.00 / 3)
they are still at it?

i just don't know what to say to him/her
i DO believe in science, just not in GM
& i don't see why i must produce scientific papers to 'prove' my point. it's just how i feel.
mean people are teh sux.
:(

come firefly-dreaming with me....


[ Parent ]
There's a scientific name for their species... (4.00 / 3)
I believe it's something like "Bullheaded Assholes", or something like that.

Then again, I'm not a scientist (heh) so I may be confusing them with other members of the Douchnozzle genus (Douchis Nozzlus)...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
Oh, another one... (4.00 / 3)
Every once in a while on dKos, especially when discussing food topics and such, I try to get people to stop by here and hang out at our (awesome!) place...

A few weeks ago I was talking to somebody over there, and I dropped a link to us and invited them to stop by.  They said something like "Oh thanks, but I'm a scientist so I disagree with OC about GM and etc..."

Didn't say anything at the time, but I got to thinking - wtf does that have to do with anything?

That would be like me saying - "Well, I'm Irish.  So I disagree with Italians."

WTF, ya know?

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
that's really why (4.00 / 3)
i'm so baffled. i've read other comments on other subjects(ecology, economy, education) by these people & they seem fairly reasonable. & yet....on this they seem... i dunno, like they are determined they have the answer.

i wasn't kidding about seven generations of testing.
THAT imnsfho, is a long term study.
& if you want me to believe something has no residual effect, that it is safe for me to ingest on a regular basis (food AND medicine) show me data on a long term, generational study.
a one month study shows me that rats are hardy animals- that's it.

come firefly-dreaming with me....


[ Parent ]
Yes! (4.00 / 3)
a one month study shows me that rats are hardy animals- that's it.

Great point!

Another sig-line worthy quote!  OMG, you are like a sig-line quote machine, Ria...

:)

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
thanks~ (4.00 / 2)
::blushing::

come firefly-dreaming with me....

[ Parent ]
it's impossible for GM people to prove anything (4.00 / 3)
it is all a big experiment. Also, it's very hard to prove a negative; thus it's very hard to prove that something this new won't cause problems further down the line.

All this tells us that GM should proceed extremely cautiously. This isn't about science vs. non-science as much as it is about being careful about opening Pandora's box vs. throwing caution to the winds and hoping for the best.

When I think of all the futile efforts at "eradicating" various species that have been engaged in over the years, the thought of loosing radically new genetic mixes into the world with only cursory preliminary investigation scares the hell out of me. As I've noted previously, they could ruin entire species of food crops this way. And saying that this isn't any different from traditional plant breeding efforts is like saying burning up all the petroleum and coal in the world in the course of a few hundred years isn't any different from growing trees for firewood over the course of millenia. The pace and scale is much, much larger/faster.

One of my best friends is a professional scientist by trade and one of the most brilliant people I've ever met, and he is TOTALLY in accord with the positions held on this site viz-a-viz GM and all sorts of other environmental issues. So don't feel like the Lone Ranger or anything.


"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


[ Parent ]
bah! (4.00 / 4)
GM is touted as being the Wonders of Science that will surpass any previous, lower-tech plant-breeding efforts.

This is rot; GM is all about making money by using whatever technology is currently available to tweak genetic material any which way that still results in viable material, without any serious overview or any real direction or adherence to anything remotely resembling responsible goals. They sell it to people the same way they sell pop weight loss techniques, like it's the next best latest cool thing.

People who are working responsibly to identify a pre-existing gene for rust resistance in wheat aren't going to be able to patent that gene. People who patch together genetic material from entirely different organisms can patent their little inventions quite easily, because there's no chance that such things ever evolved naturally. But you can bet your sweet bippy that once these nifty little freakish genetic mixes get out there, something in them will spread, in at least some cases, and generally in ways that nobody predicted. And when these little mixes involve things that were put in there on purpose because they were toxic to some living creature; caveat emptor indeed.

Traditional plant-breeding endeavors are much more scientific because they are about observation and time. You cannot learn a species by tweaking its genes with hitherto unknown material. You can only destroy it.  

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


Well, you see Jill, Jay and myself are not scientists! That is our crime. (4.00 / 4)
If you had followed this diary on DKos your head would hurt with the counter attacks from the GM trolls!

Sic Transit Gloria Locavore!



[ Parent ]
Why does anyone pay attention to DKos? (4.00 / 5)
I followed that site for a few years, but finally dropped off.  I couldn't take all the yelling and trolling: it was just a noisy cacophony.  Life is much better without it.  I've found many sites - like this one - where people can converse in a civilized fashion without flaming, trolling, or whatever.

[ Parent ]
You're right... (4.00 / 5)
It's a good source for traffic, though...

:)

But seriously, there are way more good people on there than bad.  It's just that in a few areas, especially when it comes to discussing GM and deadly chemicals like BPA (yes, there are BPA hacks and trolls on dKos too!), things that were rushed into our food systems without ever even seriously being tested for safety or anything else for that matter; there's a very small, but very loud, clique of people there who are terrified of things they can't control or understand.

One of those things is nature.  It scares them out of their wits.

The DDT guy in AAF's diary yesterday was particularly funny.  The first reply to him was a classic -

Yeah, the comeback of the bald eagle (13+ / 0-)

was tragic. Just awful.

by MaskedKat on Wed Feb 11, 2009 at 04:46:50 PM PST

Lol...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
Heh... (4.00 / 4)
No, I only cleaned up their messes in NJ for 9 years.

They're like children.  Tinkering endlessly with things they don't even try to understand, and then the adults have to follow them around and clean up after them...

Bad science makes for great brownfields and Superfund sites!

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
I think as a general rule (4.00 / 5)
anyone who says they are a scientist and you are not and that's why they can't be bothered to engage in any real discussion and don't worry your purty little head about these things that are beyond your poor simple self - is likely hiding something.

Some first rate scientists are really good teachers and love to talk about their work at any level, are perfectly delighted to encourage anyone's interest. Others are not such good teachers - but all of them love to talk about their work. If you can't understand, that's your problem. But no really inspired person is going to just blow you off as "not a scientist" if you show any interest, even adverse interest. They will instead try to explain, sometimes at greater length than you had in mind, but by God, they will try.

That's my definition of a scientist, anyway.

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


[ Parent ]
I like my head just fine the way it is (4.00 / 4)
There's a lot of good people on dKos, but there's only so much I can take of these little lock-step technology shills. They treat life far too much like it is a disease that must be cured.

And as far as you, Jill and Jay not being scientists? What makes someone a scientist, a PhD? There's an awful lot of people out there with PhD's who really aren't all that good, don't have any original thoughts at all. You will note that the best scientists, the real ones, don't go around beating their chests about their being scientists and your not being scientists. They prefer to actually write/talk about science.

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


[ Parent ]
Thank you Miep (4.00 / 3)
I quite agree with you here. A lack of a PhD does not mean that I cannot study science in my own, non-academic way.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
yes (4.00 / 3)
you can become an informed person on your own, just by reading and interacting with other informed people. You're only limited by how much time you want to spend on it, and how open-minded you're willing to be, and how much you understand how to train yourself as a critical thinker.

And another thing: what kind of really serious scientist, I mean someone who really devotes his (her) life to his work, has time to troll around the Internet looking for people criticizing biotech businesses?

Those people are busy! And to the extent they use the Web, they will likely consider their time better spent frequenting some erudite Yahoo! newsgroup talking shop with their colleagues.

Much more likely that there's squadrons of biotech PR hacks out there who are encouraged to do this on work time, and that's who's trying to start up these pissing matches, especially the ones doing it under nom d'plumes. In fact, I would be surprised if these companies didn't pay people to do this, especially on big sites like dKos.

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


[ Parent ]
companies don't necessarily pay them (4.00 / 3)
to do it but they DO pay to put up PR videos on YouTube, and at their conferences they encourage people to go around online on their own to correct "misinformation" about biotech. And then there's the most enthusiastic biotech blogger, Terry Etherton.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
there are people all over the place (4.00 / 3)
who websurf at work, and I'm sure biotech and their minions aren't immune. I was thinking in this case of people who make their money working for these companies doing it at work and their employers encouraging it, tacitly or actively. But in any case, yes, it's a big propaganda machine, one way or the other.  

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi

[ Parent ]
I'm not impressed with all this trashing of PhDs. (4.00 / 2)
So you disagree with some scientists and then trash PhDs in general? I generally agree with the points of view on this site and I generally respect you folks.  But if you can't take a more nuanced POV, I'm going to lose a lot of that respect.

By the way, I have a PhD, 1975, Economics, Univ. of Illinois.  I spent 30+ years teaching the subject.  


[ Parent ]
good point...but (4.00 / 2)
 i took that more as there are good and bad in every crowd...
that people who are serious about the science of something... have looked into it & talk about it with knowledge but more...humbly? those that beat their chest proclaiming how great they are, generally aren't. and that you don't necessarily need a sheepskin to be knowledgeableabout a subject. and that goes for PhD's & mechanics, CPA's & lawyers, & every other profession you want to name.

but i may be wrong........  

come firefly-dreaming with me....


[ Parent ]
yes, exactly n/t (4.00 / 2)


"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi

[ Parent ]
Miep did not... (4.00 / 2)
"trash PhD's in general".  Nor did anybody else here.

Sorry, I'm not sure where you saw that?

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
not at all (4.00 / 2)
I do make a distinction, though, between PhD's who are always bringing it up, and those who are more reticent about their backgrounds. Quality doesn't have to advertise, something like that.

I am not, however, accusing you of doing so.

My point was specifically that just because someone has a PhD doesn't automatically mean they are (a) smarter than you or (b) know what they're talking about. There are people who ride far too much on their degrees. They are generally pretty easy to spot.

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi


[ Parent ]
to elaborate a little more (4.00 / 2)
there's people who get their doctorates and stop dead in their tracks, and there's people who never get beyond their masters' degrees but still go on to publish 150 respectable peer-reviewed papers in their fields, and then there's smart observant amateurs without any degrees who do tons of useful fieldwork that finds its place as well. Real accomplishment in science is all over the place.

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi

[ Parent ]
I whole-heartedly agree with that statement. (4.00 / 4)


[ Parent ]
not to mention people who get their doctorates (4.00 / 2)
and then go on to teach for 30 years afterwards!

"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi

[ Parent ]
it really is awfully embarrassing (4.00 / 2)
to be accused of being down on scientists. Scientists, writers, academicians, teachers; you are all the sorts of people I come from myself. It just gets to me when people use these roles and their accompanying badges of distinction, as a weapon to try to shut people up, and I certainly haven't seen you doing that here, so I can only apologize for having inadvertently offended.


"If God were to appear to starving people, he would not dare to appear in any other form than food." - Mahatma Gandhi

[ Parent ]
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