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The Chicken Project: Hope

by: Jill Richardson

Tue Jun 08, 2010 at 23:26:57 PM PDT


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Today was a big day for chicken news. It began with an email from a resident of my city who also wants chickens. His dad is on the city council of another California city and he had asked his dad for advice about our chicken situation. Here's what he wrote me about his dad's advice:

He VERY strongly suggested doing everything possible to not let them tell you they are going to attach this to the general plan. He says that this is essentially a cop-out by the staff, and that you are more or less being stonewalled when they come back with this suggestion. Staff is almost always the force you need to overcome, before even telling him details about your experience, he said "they will almost always make a point of communicating the large number of dollars it is going to require in order for the staff to spend the time they need for studies and research on the topic". The issue of chickens needs no reinvention of the wheel. There are plenty of examples in San Diego county.

He made the obvious suggestion of emails en masse, as well as repeated visits to city council meetings with as many supporters as possible. Additionally, and somewhat surprisingly, he said that petitions are also very effective.

REALLY. I've been waiting patiently for six months and all for nothing in that case. Time to do something. More below.

Jill Richardson :: The Chicken Project: Hope
Step one was an email to the City Council. I haven't written them in a while because they know how I feel about chickens and I didn't see a need to drive them crazy and potentially piss them off. But it's been six months, so a friendly email reminder about the chickens can't be considered nagging. Here's what I wrote:

Hello,
It's been many months since I first asked to have a small number of hens (no roosters) legalized in our city with no action taken by City Council beyond tabling it and promising to address it in 2010. 2010 is now half over. Since then, I have rescued two chickens who needed a home but - as it was illegal to keep them - I had to find them a home in the city of San Diego. Our entire family (including our daughter [who attends school where a member of city council teaches]) was sad to lose our new pets only moments after we got them. Here's our story:

Last fall I began gardening in my yard, growing food for our family and using the garden to teach our children about nature and science. Our soil lacks fertility, which could be provided by chicken manure. However, in order to get chicken manure, I must drive to a garden store and purchase a plastic bag of it, wasting money, gas, and plastic in the process. The bag is heavy and I must spread it around the yard myself. If I had chickens, they would do this for free, without the effort or the oil and without sending a plastic bag to the landfill. We compost with kitchen scraps, yard waste, and worms, but the compost bin attracts the attention of our dog, who wishes he could eat the rotting food. I'd prefer feeding our kitchen scraps to chickens and composting their manure with our yard waste so our dog would have no "snacks" to forage for in the yard.

Last week, I got an email that there were 2 chickens who urgently needed a home. Over email, I found a man who was willing to take them, and I went and picked up the chickens. They were both hens, about 4 months old. We made a temporary coop for them in the yard, which was no bigger than a cage for a large dog and provided ample room for the chickens to walk around. We kept the chickens overnight so our children could see them before we handed them off to the man who offered to give them a home. At dusk, the chickens roosted and went to sleep, as chickens do each night. The next morning they were awake with the sun, quietly peeping as they scratched the ground, looking for bugs to eat. As I gardened that day, I found a pest - a Japanese beetle larva - and I fed it to a chicken, who very happily ate it. Normally I step on pests or I drown them in soapy water (which annoys me because it wastes water). I much prefer feeding the pests to the chickens who can turn them into eggs and high quality fertilizer (chicken manure) for my garden.

Our children know we've promised them pet chickens, and they are eager to get them. When they saw the chickens in our yard, they were so happy. Our little one knows the name of the breed she wants as a pet (there's a type called a "naked neck" with no feathers on its neck and our she thinks it's hilarious to say "naked chicken!") and she recognized it immediately in our yard. "I LOVE my naked neck chicken!" she told me. I helped her gently pet the chicken and feed the chickens worms as a treat. She decided to name her chicken Annika. We don't know the breed of the other one, but she's a dark color with white specs around her face. Our older daughter decided to name her Elizabeth. The chickens are docile and very good with our children. The chickens clearly like one another and they always hang out together and cuddle up together at night. The entire time they were in our yard, I could never hear them - which is more than I can say for our neighbors two dogs. They stayed within their coop, within our fence, and never got out.

As much as we loved them, the law is the law, and the chickens couldn't stay. The man who agreed to adopt them came over, bringing a box to transport the hens in. Our little one does not understand what "against the law" means so she has no idea at all why we don't have chickens yet. She cried buckets, begging her Daddy to let her keep her pet. Our older daughter was more stoic, sadly saying she wished we could keep our chickens, but without tears.

For eggs of the same caliber that our chickens would produce, I have to get up early every Sunday to drive to the farmers market before the eggs run out. There's only one farmer who raises chickens in the right way to provide top nutrition in his eggs, and his eggs are so popular he runs out almost immediately. His eggs cost $5/dozen. There's a second farmer whose eggs I occasionally buy, but those are $8/dozen. I wish I could have eggs from my own chickens, for free.

This is the impact of the city government taking no action to legalize chickens quickly. I have been patient for 6 months but I do not want to wait any longer to get my chickens. Is there any way we could allow my family to have these two chickens as a pilot project to ensure that they cause no problems to our neighbors or anyone else in our city?

Thanks,
Jill

I got two replies. Perhaps it's no coincidence, but the replies came from the two members of city council who are up for re-election this year.

Reply #1:

Thank you for reminding me that we had merely postponed vs. permanently tabled this matter.

As you recall, a permanent concern is more than just chickens. It also lies with other animals. Pets and minimum yard size...restricted to single family residences vs. multi family residences. As you point out, it really takes responsible individuals to have these animals beyond the matter of pets.

I will get this matter up to sped with our staff.  Please give me 5 points of concern that would and could arise if this one step (chickens) was legalized. Poultry neglect, abuse, and increased Public Safety/ Staff time and public health issues are not in the "5".

What are the strict guidelines and policies you would propose for the test project? Would an adjoining neighbor have the right to veto?

I replied as follows:

Wow, what a fast response! I think the concerns posed by chickens are the same ones that arise from all animals that people keep (including cats and dogs):
1. Noise
2. Smell
3. Owners who get chickens and can't take care of them or abandon them
4. Sanitary concerns (animal waste)
5. Wild animals or even other pets (dogs, cats) might eat or kill chickens.

However, it seems rather random to target one species (chickens) as an unacceptable pet while allowing so many others (dogs, cats, pot belly pigs, parrots, iguanas, etc). Dogs make noise and poop too - much more than hens do. And sometimes people adopt dogs and then can't keep them. Yet we would never suggest that these are reasons to outlaw dogs as pets. Instead we have leash laws and request that people clean up after the dogs, and I'd imagine the city has a way to address aggressive or very noisy dogs if they ever become a problem. Unlike abandoned dogs or cats, chickens in need of homes can be given to farms in the area. As for the problem of pets or wild animals killing chickens, that's also not a new problem. In fact, our dog killed our pet hamster, and my aunt's dachshund was nearly eaten by a coyote. So if those aren't reasons to ban hamsters or dogs, I don't see why it's a reason to ban chickens.

The problems chickens pose that differ from other pet animals are:
1. People might slaughter them to eat them, if you consider that a problem (as you might in an urban environment).
2. Baby chicks are often difficult to sex, so someone who orders hens might get a rooster by accident.

For people who accidentally get roosters, I can get you a list of local farms who would take any unwanted roosters. There are types of chicks called "sex links" where the color of the chick is linked to its sex (so males are one color and females are another) and people who want to be certain they get hens can get those. My boyfriend and I made a contingency plan that if we accidentally got a rooster, we'd give it to a local farm.

Typically other cities that allow chickens require they are kept in a well-kept coop and allow a certain number of chickens. Many ban roosters. Madison, WI required people to get "chicken licenses" for a small fee. Some cities ban slaughter. Some require that chickens are kept a certain number of feet from a neighbor's house, although I ask that our city not require chickens are kept prohibitively far away from neighbors houses (i.e. such a large distance that people with small yards may not have chickens at all).

Regarding a test project, do you think the neighbors should have veto power? We are next to an apartment building and I know many of the neighbors because they like to discuss my garden with me. After the amount of noise their dogs make (LOTS of noise, day and night) they would be pretty big hypocrites if they were opposed to us having chickens. I certainly think that they should be communicated with prior to any test project so that they know what to expect and can let us know if they have any concerns or requests.

The second reply I got was the following (from the member of city council who is also a teacher at my stepdaughter's school):

Thank you for your patience.  Yes it has been 6 months and the general plan is being reviewed.  I am meeting with the City Manager regarding this matter.  As you probably know after the issue was raised neighbors for and against having chickens made their feelings known to the city.  They are always going to be two sides.  I appreciate your detailed email of how legalized chickens  could help a family like yours (who is a responsible pet owner).  Since you have a first hand knowledge of what it takes to maintain chickens, perhaps you could give me a some rules that one would have to follow in order to raise chickens.

I have to say, I really, really like this member of city council. Here's how I replied to him:

Thanks so much and I appreciate the action you are taking on this. Here are rules that are common in other cities that allow chickens:

1. Chickens must be kept in a well-kept coop.
2. You may only have a small number of chickens (I'd prefer a limit of about 6 so that a family with chickens can have enough eggs to supply the whole family even after the chickens begin to age and lay fewer eggs).
3. Many cities outlaw roosters (for noise or cock-fighting concerns)
4. Some cities require the purchase of a chicken license or permit for a small fee.
5. Some cities ban slaughter.
6. Some cities require that chickens must be a certain distance from your neighbor's house. (This provision worries me as it can be prohibitive for people with small yards if the distance requirement is too large.)

One chicken-related concern that isn't present for other animals is that baby chicks are hard to sex and sometimes people buy "hens" and get a rooster by accident. For this, I'd recommend people give their unwanted roosters to nearby farms, and I can gladly provide a list of farms willing to take unwanted roosters.

Let me know if there's any other information I can provide you with.

He replied almost immediately, saying:

Thank you for all the information.  This will help.  As you probably know and I have found out these past 4 years the wheels of government often move slow.  But no excuses.  I will continue to move on this and educate myself with what other cities are doing to accommodate their residents.  I had ducks when I was little.  This will eventually all have to come before the public and all neighbors will get to have their say.

I wrote back one last time with the following:

Thanks so much. There's a documentary out there called Mad City Chickens about what happened in Madison, WI so that's one of the more famous cases that is well documented out there. http://madcitychickens.com/  Nearby, Imperial Beach just legalized chickens so you can probably find out what they found when they looked into it by talking to them. I know people in El Cajon trying to change their chicken laws, and I've heard some talk that Lemon Grove allows chickens although I'm unclear on the specifics. Outside of California, some good examples to check out are San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, and New York City.

So, we'll see what happens! This is all very exciting and quite daunting as it's my first foray into city politics. I've got a small collection of folks I've met in my city who also want to own chickens or own them already, and they've written to city council over the past six months as well. I don't think this is an issue that will affect the majority of residents of our city one way or the other, but for those of us who want chickens (or have chickens), it's important. As for what the neighbors think about us having chickens, I have two words for them: free eggs.

Previous installments of The Chicken Project:
Part 1: Initial Planning for Chickens
Part 2: Oops, it's not legal
Part 3: My public comment at City Council
Part 4: My letter to the city
Part 5: Bad News
Part 6: City Council Tables the Issue
Part 7: We Made the Local Paper!
Part 8: The San Diego Paper's Anti-Chicken Editorial
Part 9: San Diego Responds to the Union Tribune
Part 10: San Diego Paper Prints Our Letters
Part 11: We Foster Rescued Chickens
Part 12: Our Chickens Have a New Home

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I get my eggs from (4.00 / 4)
chickens that live just a few blocks from me. They are busy working the urban farm garden that I buy produce from. Talk about local food!

Do you have any idea how many places in Ca allow chickens vs places that don't? IIRC, I wouldn't be allowed to have chickens at the cabin, but the may be the HOA that bans them vs any sort of gov regs. I can have 6 chickens where I'm living. They would need to be 25ft from the neighbors houses, but if I had the coop at the back of the lot, I could pull it off even though it's a narrow yard. I was just wondering if there was a large number of places that are more heavily populated that allow or will soon allow chickens if that would help your case . . . also, perhaps do some research on reported chicken "problems" in places that allow them to see if they really are a "problem"  ;) And perhaps compare the estimated chicken population and their "problems" to say the estimated dog population and it's "problems". The number of people who will want to own chickens should remain relatively small also, but I'm sure during public comments you'll get the hand ringers that are convinced the streets will be overrun with {gasp!} hens!

Where my mom's at, they don't allow chickens either (even though she knows some have been living in her hood). It's really kinda funny since she has wild turkeys running through her backyard, lol!~


Hey! (4.00 / 3)
Welcome back. How's California?

[ Parent ]
Thanks! (4.00 / 3)
Everything's good so far. Got the first round of the garden in, farmer's market 4blocks away, and my LL and her partner have a CSA type thing going so I'm getting produce and eggs from about 6 blocks away, lol!~ by next spring, I'll prob be raising my own chickens :)

[ Parent ]
I don't know how many places (4.00 / 2)
allow it vs those that don't. It's becoming much more common for places to change the law to allow chickens all over the US.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
re: problems (4.00 / 3)
From what I hear, the noise & smell problems are LESS of a problem than people fear they will be, but the problem of abandoned chickens (particularly roosters) is MORE of a problem than they expect. However, that is a bigger problem to people who think chickens should never be eaten (i.e. vegetarians) than those who think that the easy solution for homeless chickens is a local farm that's willing to have some extra free chickens. Yes the farm might eat them - esp the roosters - but if you eat chicken why should you have a problem with that? I think it's far better for a farm to eat a homeless rooster than for an animal shelter to euthanize a homeless dog or cat.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
I also think (4.00 / 4)
it's better for the roosters  to grow and have a little bit of nice life before being eaten, rather than simply killed at birth.

And, sadly, chickens are made to be eaten, even if I don't eat my chickens. For a while, we were a hawk's favorite restaurant.

As it was, he did a deal with a blancmange, and the blancmange ate his wife.


[ Parent ]
Beware of Neighbor Permission (4.00 / 5)
Good work, Jill! As you go forward with your city council to craft a new ordinance, my advice would be to be very careful about NOT allowing a neighbor's feedback to become part of the process. Here in Denver we not only have to get an Animal Control permit, but we also have to get a Zoning Variance. That variance involves posting an official big sign on our house (like you'd have to do if you wanted to get a liquor license) that invites neighbors to comment. If a neighbor objects, you don't get your chickens. It's a completely screwy system, and one that we're trying to change.

Really, the best thing to do is to just leave the "chicken permit" completely out of it. Dogs and cats (a limited number of them, anyway) are a "use by right," meaning they can be owned without a permit. (You may have to license your cats or dogs, but that's not the same thing.) You can set guidelines in the city ordinance for how the animals should be kept, but there's no need to have a special permitting process.

To read more about Denver's crazy permitting system, plus what we're trying to achieve for our city, go to http://www.sustainablefooddenv...


Thanks (4.00 / 4)
I'd CONSIDER letting the neighbors veto a "pilot project" of our chickens, since this is something we'd be doing that's outside of the current city law (albeit with the city's permission). However, I think there's NO WAY the neighbors should have a right to veto chickens as part of the legalization law. I mean, can I veto my neighbors' dogs because they are loud? They are REALLY loud. I hear barking day and night and I don't like it very much. What if they have a tarantula and I'm afraid of spiders? Or a snake? Can I veto those pets? Obviously I can't veto those so they shouldn't be able to veto my chickens. I can complain if their dogs bother me so much that it's really an issue, and likewise, if I keep a smelly, unsanitary chicken coop then they would have a right to bust me for not following the law of having a well-kept coop for my chickens.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
Politics (4.00 / 5)
Jill:  As the son of a politician, I learned early in life that using "logic" and "persuasion" is generally an ineffective way to get laws changed. Usually what has to happen is that you need some kind of powerful emotional "hook" or else you need to piggyback onto some larger movement.  Think of all those laws passed after a child was kidnapped, for example.

I'm thinking that an effective way to legalize chickens would actually be to downplay the "it's logical and wise to have chickens" argument and instead bury it inside a larger "Urban Gardening" movement. Get the city council to table some kind of "Organic Green Gardens" proposal that promotes recycling of kitchen waste and (insert some other popular green cause like eliminating pesticides).

Then, deep inside the legislation, insert something like "Nothing in these rules shall be construed to prohibit residents with organic gardens from raising up to 6 domestic hens for the purpose of creating nitrogen-rich soils and eliminating pests, provided such animals reside in such conditions as meet state and local laws."

Brilliant, right?


hahaha (4.00 / 4)
great idea. I'll try it if we need to but I have to say that I think these are pretty decent people we've got on the city council (not seasoned slimy politicians) and I believe they are acting in good faith. At least, I'm going to give them that benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
Unfortunately... (4.00 / 3)
Sadly, he's right. I had the most pro-chicken member of the Denver city council tell me the same thing. He said that logic is irrelevant, and it doesn't matter if you're "right."

[ Parent ]
Breaking out the kids (4.00 / 3)
is often helpful. If there's a local 4H group, they might be able to supply more chicken-savvy kids.

As it was, he did a deal with a blancmange, and the blancmange ate his wife.

[ Parent ]
One bit of advice (4.00 / 4)
Search around and find the text of a good existing pro-chicken law. That's half the work the City Council would need to do in order to legalize those 'dangerous and filthy' chickens. Doing that would eliminate another excuse and weaken the inertia of getting anything done. It makes you more like the big corporations that write our federal laws anyway.

Colorado Springs (4.00 / 4)
Colorado Springs has a good chicken law -- up to 10 fowl as a use-by-right (no permit required).

[ Parent ]
washing chickens.. (4.00 / 4)
When I can't sleep or read at night, I watch Tori and Dean on Oxygen.They have chickens and in the episode I watched last night they were washing the chickens because they smelled. Is that something other folks do?

We wash them for the fair (4.00 / 2)
But sure, washing them because they smell is fine too. It's just like washing the dog.

As it was, he did a deal with a blancmange, and the blancmange ate his wife.

[ Parent ]
I don't think chickens smell (4.00 / 3)
unless they get into something smelly and that makes them smell. When I let the litterbox get REALLY gross, sometimes my cats slightly smell. They like themselves so much that it's only really slight even then. But if they ever got into something that they couldn't lick clean, I'd give 'em a bath. So far, no cat baths, and I've been a cat owner for 5 years. I'd do the same for the chickens if the chickens couldn't get clean via dust baths and preening. But hopefully I wouldn't let their coop get so stinky to begin with.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
Some chickens do smell (4.00 / 4)
and there seem to be distinct differences by breed.

The cornish/rock crosses that are generally used for meat chickens are the most stinky, and they seem to collect an odor even if kept very clean in generous spacing.

My daughter's bantams aren't smelly at all. Currently we have some standard size chickens, and they carry more odor.

Even so, when I am talking about smell, I am talking about, worst case scenario, about the same odor level as a stinky dog. IE, if you're within a few feet of the animal, you notice it, but even then it's not overpowering.

 

As it was, he did a deal with a blancmange, and the blancmange ate his wife.


[ Parent ]
oh ok (4.00 / 3)
I'm not a fan of smelly animals AT ALL (typically it's dogs that I don't like the smell of) but I get all cuddly with any chicken that will let me. Haven't smelled a thing yet. Wouldn't be nearly so into chickens if I had. But I certainly believe you on this.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
You wouldn't want a cornish/rock cross (4.00 / 2)
as a pet anyway - they just keel over and die if you don't slaughter them on time.

Even though our standard breeds have some odor, it's light and not unpleasant. They're fun to hold. I've been interested to see how different the personalities are of the different breeds. The Buckeyes are the most curious and human-oriented so far - but ours don't like to be held. They like to just perch on you. The others would rather be held.

As it was, he did a deal with a blancmange, and the blancmange ate his wife.


[ Parent ]
Great Letter (4.00 / 3)
I was impressed by how well written this letter is. Comparisons to dogs, IMHO, is a great one.

Portland allows 3 chickens, no roosters, (4.00 / 4)
without a license. Here is the text of the city code for all animals.] Section 13.05.015, paragraph E, refers specifically to the 3 chicken rule.

It is possible to have more than 3 chickens, but that requires a license and there are more rules.

It may help you to have copies of the ordinances from other cities to  present to your elected officials.  


Thanks (4.00 / 2)
I have sent those along before :)  

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
50 ft from residences? (4.00 / 2)
Wait a second... the Portland regs look good, until you get to 13.05.035. Are they saying that you're allowed to have 3 chickens (or 3 dwarf goats), but you can't keep them anywhere within 50 feet of your residence?

Here in Denver our lots aren't that big (125'x 50'), so if that was the requirement here, I couldn't have animals -- it would be impossible to find a spot on my property that's 50' from the house.


[ Parent ]
Interesting... (4.00 / 2)
My friends just down the street (we live in an inner city neighborhood of Portland) keep 5 hens (they have a permit for more than 3) in their backyard, and for that matter probably 30% or so of my neighbors also do.  Nobody here in Creston-Kenilworth has property that big.

So the "rules" aren't being enforced to the letter on that end...

Good!

Maybe that part of the code needs to be formally dropped.  I'll keep it in mind for when I make my City Council run in 47.5 months.

;)

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
I'm not sure what that part of the regs (4.00 / 3)
means. It refers to picketing an animal. Isn't that staking an animal on a rope or chain out in a yard or field? However, if you keep 3 chickens you do not have to keep them 50 feet away from your residence. Any structure you have for them (coop, pen, etc.) must be 15 feet from any residence, though.

I once had neighbors here who kept chickens. Every time I walked outside and actually saw a chicken crossing the road, I totally cracked up.


[ Parent ]
Full text... (4.00 / 2)
It is unlawful to picket any livestock, or allow any livestock to roam, so that it may approach within 50 feet of any building used as a residence, or any commercial building in which foodstuff is prepared, kept or sold.

Sounds like there are some contradictions in the language itself, but obviously nothing that authorities have decided to be actionable...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens


[ Parent ]
But they could if they wanted to... (4.00 / 4)
Even if the authorities have decided to overlook the 50-feet-from-a-residence thing, the problem is that since that language is on the books they have a right to enforce it (selectively) if they want to. I find this kind of situation to be troublesome, because since the authorities DON'T enforce it regularly there isn't a public outcry about the ridiculousness of the rule (and therefore, it's not dropped from the ordinance). However, it lingers there as part of the law, and can be dropped on someone at the authorities' discretion.

Also, something like that in the ordinance makes it difficult for other cities (like Denver) to point to Portland as having a more progressive ordinance that we want to emulate. Although I wish it weren't so, many City Councilmembers need to see "who else is doing it" before they will consider making changes here. A 50-foot rule would effectively prohibits everyone in Denver who lives on a regular single or double city lot from owning animals -- you'd have to live way out on the fringes of the city.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that if there's any way to officially explain away that 50-foot rule in the Portland ordinance, it would make it easier to hold it up as an example to emulate.

(As Jay was referencing, the rule is silly and unnecessary, by the way. My chickens live pretty darn close to my house -- and my neighbor's house -- and there aren't any problems.)  


[ Parent ]
banding (4.00 / 3)
Does the subject of banding ever come up in discussions about legalizing urban chickens? Do any codes have banding requirements? I suppose from a municipality's perspective, banding might make the program more complicated and expensive, but maybe not unreasonably so.

The two hens you babysat for a day or so could have been traced to their original owners if they had been banded and in a registry. I'm not sure banding would serve any other useful purpose. Is banding a good idea? Bad idea? Just an unnecessary complication?


I haven't heard any talk of that (4.00 / 3)
and I would be quite unhappy if I did. As long as there's no law requiring collars on dogs and cats, why should they require bands on chickens?

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
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