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Cognitive Dissonance No Problem For Clintons

by: Jill Richardson

Sun Sep 27, 2009 at 16:24:49 PM PDT


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Hillary Clinton gave the closing remarks at the Clinton Global Initiative meeting this week. The subject? Solving global hunger. Her remarks are particularly important because, as Secretary of State, she oversees USAID, the agency that will administer any U.S. effort to feed the world. And it's no coincidence also that there is a particular effort going on right now to call for a "Second Green Revolution." That is, exporting industrial agriculture techniques, chemicals, and seeds to developing nations.

Where's the cognitive dissonance? When Bill Clinton spoke (he was there to introduce Hillary), he brought Will Allen up on stage and called Allen his "hero." Will Allen is one of my heroes too. I just got back from Allen's farm, a few hours ago actually. Growing Power, founded by Will Allen, is located in Milwaukee, WI. I've heard about it and written about it and finally I've seen it. They use sustainable, low input techniques to grow TONS of food. Year round, with relatively little fossil fuel heat, in a climate that is very cold for much of the year. They provide healthy food to a neighborhood that is 2 miles away from a grocery store in any direction.

Their first and foremost "crops" are compost and worms. Growing Power uses food waste and municipal waste (such as wood chips) to feed their worms and their methane digester. The methane then fuels furnaces, which heats water to 85F to allow tilapia to thrive. Tilapia are a warm water vegetarian fish. At Growing Power, they are grown in aquaponics systems that grow three crops stacked on top of one another - tilapia and two layers of plants such as watercress. The fish waste feeds the plants and the plants clean the water. The fish are highly productive, producing 1 lb of flesh per 1 lb of food. They also produce perch, cold water fish, also in aquaponics systems that grows crops on top of fish ponds. The perch eat soldier fly larvae, which live in Growing Power's compost. Using such agroecological, innovative systems, they produce a LOT of food in a very small amount of space. In addition to the plants (watercress, arugula, wheatgrass, other microgreens, spinach, tomatoes, and more), they also raise chickens for eggs, ducks and turkeys for meat, bees for pollination and honey, and goats (eventually for milk).

The inputs to Growing Power's farm are waste products (food, roots from harvested crops, manure, wood chips). They use some energy from the grid, I believe. But most of what they use can be gotten from their own livestock and plants, plus some rainwater harvesting. The innovations they showed us today did not involve GM crops, pesticides, or commercial fertilizer. They fertilize with compost and worm castings and they deal with pests with compost tea. So why, if the Clintons consider Will Allen their hero, are they pushing a form of agriculture that runs entirely counter to what Will Allen has proven so successful?

You can see a video of the Clintons' speeches here.

Jill Richardson :: Cognitive Dissonance No Problem For Clintons
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I saw the closing of the plenary session video (4.00 / 6)
It was very moving to see Will Allen up on stage with everyone else (sheesh he's tall). And it was nice that Bill said what he said about being born in a house with an outhouse instead of a bathroom, etc.

But the answer to your question -

So why, if the Clintons consider Will Allen their hero, are they pushing a form of agriculture that runs entirely counter to what Will Allen has proven so successful?

is a simple artifact of associates. Neither of the Clintons is a farmer. Bill may have been born on a farm, but he's not even as close to farming as GW Bush or Bill Gates. The people who the Clintons associate with, at least profesisonally, I would hazard a guess, if any of them are farmers, are commodities farmers, not small tightly dialed in, integrated/diversified farmers like Will Allen. The rest of the people the Clintons associate with who have anything to do with agriculture, are only involved with commodity ag, and the industries that support it and that it supports.

In short, the Clintons don't know any better and they certainly aren't going to be told any different by the people who have their ear.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....


I quite agree (4.00 / 3)
and while Hillary gave an incredibly compelling speech about the need for solving world hunger, her science adviser is Nina Federoff, and we all know where she stands on this stuff. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08...

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
Yup, 'nuf said..... nt (4.00 / 2)


Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....

[ Parent ]
Better link? (4.00 / 1)
This might be a better link, I'm not sure...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08...

or

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08...


[ Parent ]
Federoff (4.00 / 1)
The dateline on that NYT article is August, 2008, at which time Federoff would have been science advisor for Condi Rice.

Is Federoff also Clinton's science advisor?


[ Parent ]
Yes, (4.00 / 2)
according to her entry in Wikipedia.

[ Parent ]
Yep (4.00 / 2)
she's a hold over from the Bush administration.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
Allen (4.00 / 1)
According to his wiki, Allen was a pro basketballer. He's a 6'7" native Marylander.

[ Parent ]
yes, he's enormous (4.00 / 1)
and absolutely does NOT look his age. He looks closer to 40 than 60 if you ask me. He's also one of the nicest people I've ever met.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
1 lb of flesh per 1 lb of food (4.00 / 2)
The indicated efficiency of converting plant matter to protein and fat seems too good to be true. I say "seems" because I don't know the facts, but I can't think of anything else in the animal kingdom that could come anything close to that.  

I realize that (4.00 / 2)
I've got no idea to be honest. That's what the woman on the tour told me. I will check with "Tilapia Mama" - a friend in San Diego who knows her tilapia.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
After the ensuing discussion (4.00 / 1)
I see why Growing Power, and Geraci in Baltimore, want to grow tilapia. The conversion rate is awesome.

[ Parent ]
Here's some info on feed conversion in Tilapia (4.00 / 3)
Cage Culture of Tilapia and it says that average feed conversion in that system is 1.5 to 1.8 (1.5 being that it takes 15 grams of feed to produce 10 grams of weight gain in the fish).

This report claims a feed conversion rate of 1.19:1, which is pretty darned good! Tilapia Production in Ponds with Soy-Based Feed

Gawd I adore the internet!!!!!

Ya know what they call Tilapia in Africa?
Hippo Suckers. The fish live on skin parasites and the manure of the river hippos.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....


[ Parent ]
The first thing we notice (4.00 / 1)
is that the feeds in those studies are sythentics, fortified to high protein levels. The higher the levels of protein and oil, the more efficient the conversion is.

Even so, those numbers are indeed awfully good. If they can be achieved by actual farmers, I'll be impressed. (From your first link, the numbers might be from actual farmers.)

Well, Jill, 1.19 rounds off to one. Your tour guide might have been essentially correct, depending on how much protein is in the feed.


[ Parent ]
Your tour guide (4.00 / 1)
didn't know your readers would include a guy so persnickety about numbers!

[ Parent ]
Keep in mind that (4.00 / 2)
the numbers I posted/referred to were for overal growth of the fish. I don't know what the meat to offal is. Although that could be ground up into a meal and fed back to the fish. Tilapia probably eat dead tilapia in the wild, essentially being scavengers, so I don't think there would be any kind of disease risk doing that.

If you were to use the whole fish like that, and combine the fish meal with outside inputs, you're feed conversion would be even more efficient as you'd be using minimal inputs. I think in a video I saw Will explain that they fed the tilapia worm castings as a part of their feed ration?

I'll have to go back and watch those videos again.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....


[ Parent ]
Scavengers (0.00 / 0)
I know nothing about the table manners of tilapia, would vegetarian tilapias eat dead tilapias?

[ Parent ]
To my knowleage in the wild (4.00 / 2)
tilapia are not vegetarian. Most fish aren't. Even the filter feeders would eat zooplankton, not just phytoplankton. When you're straining great mouthfulls of water, it's kind of hard to pick and choose. Even Humpbacked whales and other animals that eat little critters like krill wind up eating small fish here and there, I suppose especially if the small fish were feeding on the krill that the whales were after and couldn't get out of the way.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....

[ Parent ]
Perhaps I was mistaken (4.00 / 3)
was just at their website and it said that they feed ground up salad greens, duck weed, worms and the tilapia feed on the algae on the tank walls as well.

Considering all of that, if that's all they're feeding those fish, then they have as close to a closed system as you can get.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....


[ Parent ]
or perhaps (4.00 / 1)
maybe because of your information, all the critters need is approx 1 lb of extra food. Either way, it's a good system.

[ Parent ]
yep (4.00 / 2)
the fish eat worms in addition to duck weed, etc. They said that on the tour.

"I can understand someone from Iowa promoting corn and soy, but we are not feeding the world, we are feeding animals and soft drink companies." - Jim Goodman

[ Parent ]
fish meal (0.00 / 0)
The feed used in the experiments at my link below contained fish meal, as well as liver.

Perhaps the conversion rates in those experiments are not as efficient as the data from your links because tilapia don't like liver? Whatever the explanation, obviously conversion rates will be specific to each type of food, as well as each type of fish.


[ Parent ]
tilapia food conversion rates (4.00 / 2)
From tilapia conversion rates

conversion rate (grams of feed required to produce a gram of fish)

For Java tilapia

Percent fed Conversion
1 4.1
2 2.5
3 3.6
4 5.6

For Nile tilapia

Percent fed Conversion
1 2.8
2 4.0
3 5.4
4 6.0

In these experiments, the best conversion rate for Java tilapia was 2.5 grams of feed produced 1 gm of fish. In Nile tilapia, 2.8 gm feed produced 1 gm of fish, and this feed was not vegetarian, it included 20% liver.

We know one huge concern about salmon farming is that 2 to 4 grams of wild fish are required to produce 1 gm of farmed salmon. Factory farmers are trying to get that ratio down closer to 1:1 by mixing the wild fish with vegetable substitutes (so far not successful), but that is not 1:1 for total food input, it is merely 1:1 for the wild fish component.


[ Parent ]
Can readers decipher (4.00 / 1)
the examples? My spacing didn't work out right.

[ Parent ]
I see it fine. n/t... (4.00 / 1)
...

Coming soon to a Philadelphia near you!

[ Parent ]
I agree with Joanne (4.00 / 3)
It's not cognitive dissonance unless they have both ideas in their heads... and maybe they just think that Will Allen's system isn't achievable in different countries... especially desert countries. He has a lot of waste inputs, which may not be available in the poorest of nations.  

I think that's the point (4.00 / 3)
of Will Allen, actually, and Jill's thought about cognitive dissonance. I doubt that Allen made a committment to transfer a model developed for urban Milwaukee to a place that is not urban Milwaukee. I think he committed his resources to helping people make the best use of resources available to them, wherever they are, and this is especially important where resources are scarce - like desert countries. This is where I see the least role for Roundup Ready seeds and terminator seeds, and chemical fertilizers.

At least, that's what I took from Jill's essay. My thinking was preconditioned by a conversation with one of my sons, who took a course in political economy or economic developement in the mid-'90s. His professor was very critical of western aid efforts that insisted on the use of inappropriate technology. He lambasted the thinking that said a community couldn't do something unless it had construction cranes and DC-6 Caterpillars, when in fact it had a plentiful supply of manpower that could do the job. Not as quickly, but they could do the job.

I understand your point that industrialized ag might be appropriate in certain areas. I'm not sure where that would be, though.


[ Parent ]
supply of manpower (4.00 / 2)
supply of unemployed manpower

[ Parent ]
Ya.. (4.00 / 1)
my main point was just that the headline was misleading. We don't know what's in their heads. I'm certainly not pro industrial ag.. but I haven't come to the conclusion that it's entirely bad or that good organic sustainable techniques can work everywhere.  

[ Parent ]
brown rice (4.00 / 1)
Path, an organization in the first group of committments, committed to introducing "fortified rice" into India, using strains with elevated levels of micronutrients.

I know what "fortified" usually means, I know what "strains" usually means, and I know what "elevated levels" always means. For some reason, I don't know what my first sentence means, with all those terms in it.

The Indian woman runs a manufacturing company that sells biscuits fortified by the addition of chemicals. Perhaps that's better than nothing.

I wonder, though, how malnourished Indian children might be helped just by eating brown rice instead of white rice, which is so nutrition-deficient that it has to be fortified in the good ole U.S. of A. According to Netzer, one cup of cooked long grain brown rice contains about 1/2 the iron as one cup of cooked fortified white long grain rice, and MORE of the minerals with which white rice is not fortified.

And one cup of uncooked brown rice yields more cooked rice than one cup of uncooked white rice.

According to Netzer, again, brown rice is better than white rice for all listed vitamins except thiamine, in which case brown rice has 0.09 mg/half-cup and fortified white rice has 0.13 mg/half-cup.

People would get more vitamins and minerals by using brown rice instead of white rice supplemented by a few manufactured food-like tablets, unless the biscuits were fortified at really high levels. The conclusion seems obvious, except that it wouldn't maximize corporate profit.


emmer (4.00 / 1)
Jay, I tried to find numbers for emmer, really I did, but my ancient edition of Netzer doesn't list it.

[ Parent ]
Someone call my name? :) (4.00 / 1)
Heh...

Might be under farro?  Same exact grain, just the European name.

Farro kinda became the default name for it over the past century since Northern Italy and North Africa were the only places that kept growing it until it found its way back into favor as an heirloom grain here in the Northwest over the past few years...

Coming soon to a Philadelphia near you!


[ Parent ]
Farro (4.00 / 1)
No, she doesn't have that either. A newer edition probably would.

There's a huge section on fast foods, though.


[ Parent ]
Idea for a new "crusade" (4.00 / 1)
Let's tax the bejeebus out of white rice. It probably would solve the national deficit problem, at least until Americans started eating brown rice.

[ Parent ]
Just try to tax my white rice (4.00 / 1)
Damn Revenuers!

I can't stand the flavor of brown rice. If my only choice was to buy brown rice, I wouln't eat rice at all.

Everyone who I know that eats white rice does so because they hate the flavor of the bran.

Just like with white flour. As the info over at Bob's Red Mill in Milwaukie, Oregon, explaned, white flour is simply flour from the endosperm only, and doesn't contain the germ or the bran. That's for unbleached white flour, they type I use.

White flour keeps longer than whole wheat flour as it has less oil. Whole wheat can go rancid, although I think this would probably be more of a problem for someone who has their grain ground and stores the resultant flour for the year. That's how Harold's family used to do it when he was a kid. They'd harvest and thresh the wheat, then load up the wagon and go to town where the mill was. It'd take a couple days and they'd camp along the river near the mill. When the flour was ready and bagged, they'd load up the wagon and head back home. I think the mill was only around 10 miles from the farm, but when you're doing that with horses pulling a wagon, you're looking at probably a 7-8 hour round trip. It's easier just to stay put until your flour's ready to bring home.

His dad also cut the wheat with a big ass scythe that had a cradle on it, and the kids would come along behind and put it up in shocks.

Regarding locavores as elitists - explain to me how supporting local business is elitist....


[ Parent ]
Shelf life (0.00 / 0)
Ouch, there I go, stepping on toes again.

Yes, I know. Shelf life is why Quaker, now a Pepsico brand, removes the nutrition from yellow corn meal, and it's probably why our southerners got the tradition of removing nutrition from corn meal to make white hominy. Shelf life is undoubtedly a consideration for families who buy rice in 25-lb or 50-lb bags. In a country where 60% of school children are anemic, though, I question the idea that buying rice in 50-lb bags is "appropriate technology", the idea that manufactured biscuits are an appropriate solution, and the idea that India's malnutrition problem can best be solved by new strains of rice provided by western multinational conglomerates. Just eat brown rice. (Hey, Bill and Hillary, are you reading this?)

I just thought of a question regarding the precooked microwave-ready white rice that is now available in our conventional supermarkets. I wonder how it is made. Although white rice is bereft of micronutrients, whatever vitamins and minerals are in uncooked white rice would be in the cooked rice if it were cooked the way I would make it, if I cooked white rice.

If the rice were cooked in excess water, and the water drained off, much of the de minimus micronutrients would go down the sewer, even from fortified rice.

Has anyone seen anything about this on an episode of "Unwrapped"?


[ Parent ]
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