Bloomberg To City: Drop Dead

Ummm, I have a problem with this (0.00 / 0)

So Bloomberg also apparently has something against food retailers and other businesspeople in the City, as well.

No, he does not. In fact, he tends to favor growing the right kind of food retailers. Before all this "outrage" started and when we started getting hit with the layoffs/economy down turn, he/the city were out there talking about how they were working on expanding farmers markets/availability of fresh food to the 'hoods that need it (you should see what some rely on for "food sources"!) and making sure lower income people/families could actually get the food (access AND affordable). Subsidies for retailers etc. Fresh produce carts have increased in the city along with farmers markets/etc.

You can disagree with him on the food stamp issue and other things, but as far as "food retailers" go and healthy eating, he's a far cry from what we've had in the past. Do you really think Rudy gave a sh!t about poor people getting fresh food from a farmers market? And I say this as a single person with no kids who generally gets screwed when it comes to any help from the government.

Also, remember, people are posturing for 2010. I think part of Bloomberg's issues with the funding is the strings attached. But it's much easier to scream (pol who wants his job) Bloomberg wants poor people to starve. Patterson is getting blasted also on budget issues. Of course many of those making the most noise aren't offering any alternatives. (yes, I've had it up to {here} with the BS!) {grin} I tend to take what I can get with politicians*, and with Bloomberg, one thing is better food and greater access to it for EVERYONE.

* and no, I don't sit by quietly on other issues, lol!~

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 03:24:11 AM UTC

No. (4.00 / 1)

Do you really think Rudy gave a sh!t about poor people getting fresh food from a farmers market?

And I didn't say that anywhere.

and with Bloomberg, one thing is better food and greater access to it for EVERYONE.

Except for single people who are out of work.

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 03:48:29 AM UTC

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About Rudy . . . . (0.00 / 0)

Apologies, I didn't mean for what I wrote to imply you did say that. I was going for comparison. It's a refreshing difference to have a politician caring about what food is available no matter what your income.

Side note: last summer when I was packing up leftover distribution from our CSA for the church that uses it for their community, I had to "laugh" at what we were supplin'. Those gosh darn arugula eating folks  ;) Damn Liberals, lol!~  ;)

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 04:24:43 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

And if he did care about that... (4.00 / 1)

He would consider this -

Increased income support has been part of the federal response to most recessions, and for good reason: It is the most efficient way to prime the economy's pump ... Boosting food stamp payments by $1 increases GDP by $1.73 (see Table 2). People who receive these benefits are hard pressed and will spend any financial aid they receive very quickly.

Denying benefits certainly doesn't help any kinds of establishments, does it?

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 03:50:23 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I'm not debating the food stamp issue (0.00 / 0)

I'm debating that you said he "apparently has something against food retailers and other businesspeople". He doesn't. Unless you're selling crap food or restricting access of healthy food.

The reason I'm not debating the food stamp issue is I've been too swamped to wrap my brain around it. Will be doing that starting in the next day or so as work has lifted a bit :) I do recall him talking about alternatives etc, but really haven't been able to look into where he's really going with his thought process. Again, I think there may also be an issue with what accepting the money makes him agree to, but I need to look at both sides. The money/waiver may expand food spending, but does he have plans that would also? Etc? I don't always agree with Bloomberg, but I have learned to look at what he's thinking before falling into the media line. I find it an interesting concept that he would willingly leave a portion of the unemployed without a food safety net when he has been pretty good on food issues and access to it for, yes, everyone.  

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 04:17:54 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I don't find it surprising at all, actually... (4.00 / 1)

I find it an interesting concept that he would willingly leave a portion of the unemployed without a food safety net when he has been pretty good on food issues and access to it for, yes, everyone.

He's a hypocrite.  He says one thing, does another.  Just like The Governator out here on the other Coast.  It's easy to play political one-upsmanship when you're personally worth 20 billion dollars.

And since Bloomberg's denying extension of food assistance benefits to the unemployed, shouldn't we ask ourselves who is he really helping by doing so?  

Because fresh fruits and vegetables aren't just going to magically appear in these people's kitchens, and they can't get their daily caloric needs solely from 'principled' conservative opposition to government spending.  So what are they going to eat then, and who is going to get what little food money they do have?  Yeah, those same corner shops and convenience stores selling the cheapest possible crap around.

After all, who is Bloomberg supposed to be working for?  The people of the City of New York.  And many people in the City of New York are in great need of assistance right now.  That's what government is for.  Let's save the considerations of 'string attachments' and etc for the blow-dried airheads screaming talking points past each other on the cable news shows.

Talk is cheap.

Bloomberg's press releases and talking points, along with a dollar seventy-five, will buy a cup of coffee.

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:05:04 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Got to call you on that one nycstray (4.00 / 1)

I don't care what he said. Just name one thing he did.

The man and his ultra large army of bureaucrats talks an awful lot but actions are all that matters.

My old community lobbied the city to turn an abandoned property into a a community garden. My old neighborhood had two community gardens that Rudy closed down and now has none but the city would not open the property because of sales potential.

Three years later still an empty lot and people are still getting turned down.

I don't think selling permits for produce carts is a feather in the city governments cap and I don't know that the city gets credit for any of the newer farmer's markets. I know they show up and take credit for something community activist broke their asses to get started but allowing people to actually do something is no big deal.    

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by: Eddie C @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 04:27:38 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I guess I base it partly on forward action (0.00 / 0)

be it by the community/groups or the actual city.  Which environment is better to work in and where are we going? etc.

Sure, the animal welfare groups are doing all the heavy lifting, but they were given the environment and support to do so. Bloomberg made that happen (I have a 1 month Dalmatian euth file from the end of the Rudy era at the city shelter that still breaks my heart. These dogs had an out). With the carts and gardens, we may be doing the heavy lifting etc, but was Rudy listening/helping? Bloomberg/the City is at least receptive now, and Bloomberg does understand preventive vs non. Like I said, I take what I can get and work for more.

I'm more than sure there are still major problems, but I also see a lot of improvements (I get snow plows now!!!, lol!~). Bloomberg does expect people to do the work, but I think on certain issues like decent food, he at least allows the environment for action/discussion/opportunity. I happen to think selling permits for city carts is a "feather" as there are more carts. Does it belong in the city's cap? Who knows, and how much should we care? We have them. Would we have gotten them in the past/future? (discounting Rudy) Who knows? He (Bloomberg) may see it as a totally financial thing, but if it helps us, should we reject it?

I will say that on the issue of a new influx of fresh produce availability, it sounded like the city was at least supporting the push (I was working and listening with half an ear) Maybe they were just taking credit, but city dollars/effort were in the mix. I'll take that.

I guess I'm not willing to throw out the baby with the bath water, but would rather keep working on the baby's bath as long as the water is warm ;)

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 05:33:05 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

That's what it's down to (4.00 / 1)

The expectations of New Yorkers has been so lowered that you appreciate allowing "the environment for action/discussion/opportunity."

You know when I get a gauge of New York City? Whenever I go to another city and see what other governments can offer with lower sales, lower income tax and lower real estate tax. You know when you are not in NYC. Anytime you can ask someone where there is a public bathroom and get an answer that is less than fifty blocks away. Pissing is a privilege here.

But how do you feel about a man who pretended he believed in referendums while secretly plotting behind everyone's backs to overturn the will of the people?    

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by: Eddie C @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:02:53 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Umm, expectations? (0.00 / 0)

"the environment for action/discussion/opportunity" should be a given. And the fact that it's there and available is appreciated since we can see the flip side through experience. I wouldn't call that lowered expectations, but my right.

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:29:25 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

Shoot, accidently posted (0.00 / 0)

and didn't finish my thought :)

as far as the running for third term? Don't give a crap. He'll either run as a R or I. Give me a Dem that is willing to stand up RIGHT NOW and start challenging him, countering his ideas with better ones. Heck, (remember, per above, I haven't checked out this food stamp issue all the way yet) give me one now that will give a very good alternative solution to the food stamps and other related issues. And if they just say take the money, lay out long term effects.  That's really all I want from my politicians. If all I'm going to get is bitching and moaning about Bloomie and his ideas with no counter solution, how am I better served?

I want somebody to freakin' do something! If I can't get that, I'll take the environment for action/discussion/opportunity and any progress we can make.

Pls note, I have the same issues re:Patterson and the outrage. Nobody is offering an alternative from what I've heard. I'm just tired of all the BS and want some strong voices :)

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:41:19 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

You really don't give a crap? (4.00 / 1)

The tiny little bit of Democracy that we have in this representative republic, the public referendum that I and many others broke our asses passing twice because we are totally fed the fuck up with entrenched elected officials who do not represent the people and you don't give a crap!

Did you ever ask yourself why you don't hear these "counter solutions" and why the opposition is framed as "bitching and moaning about Bloomie?" You don't suppose it could be because Bloomie owns a major media outlet, do you?

Millionaires protect millionaires and Bloomberg defends NY's poor millionaires with nothing for you. Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean there are no Democrats that have better ideas. Plenty have suggested that perhaps making up new excise taxes for the workers who can't afford to put food on the table while protecting Bloomberg's cohorts because their statements don't look so good anymore is the actions of a creep.

Oh and I might also point out that it was the responsibility of Bloomberg's company to uncover the coming meltdown and instead he covered for his fellow millionaires there too. Well that doesn't matter with present estimates of around $100 per voter that he will spend in the upcoming election.

Did you happen to hear about the tens of thousands who rallied  for fair share tax reform or did you hear Bloomberg's media spin that it was government workers begging to keep their jobs?

It is so easy to say there is no plausible alternative even though the Democrats have only one problem with their ideas. Bloomie is loud and clear and the Democrats are suppressed. Bloomie purchased your confidence and pretty soon when you pull that lever he will have purchased your vote too.

I could sit here and make a list a mile long about the things you never found out about Bloomberg but really if you don't give a crap about overturning a twice voted for public referendum then you wouldn't be impressed.      

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by: Eddie C @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 15:31:16 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Great point right there... (4.00 / 1)

You know when I get a gauge of New York City? Whenever I go to another city and see what other governments can offer with lower sales, lower income tax and lower real estate tax.

I mean, believe me, we have many problems of our own here - but there are public restrooms, most of which are very clean, all over the place here in Portland (we have no city or state sales tax), not only Downtown but also scattered throughout our neighborhoods; and for 9 months out of the year you can hardly walk a few blocks anywhere throughout the city without tripping over a farmers market.

Sure, somebody could make the argument that we're like one-tenth the size of NYC, but again - what does that have to do with throwing up a few public toilets here and there?  San Francisco does it...

Pissing is a privilege here.

Lol, I want to make that my sigline!

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:30:43 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

And when you think about it (4.00 / 1)

The less concentrated a community is the more it should cost to offer a service.

But New York does have some service.

 

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by: Eddie C @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:43:06 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

heh, and how many NYers are there? (0.00 / 0)

I'm tempted to pull out my fav city ad campaign pic here. Advertising animal shelter adoptions on garbage trucks . . . . Oy.

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:51:46 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I'm not totally up on the public bathroom issue (4.00 / 1)

but I do know attempts have been made here. Especially in the high tourist areas. Something about those Euro porta potty pay thingies . . . What kind of public access do you have there? How could we adapt it? (public potties are beyond my scope here, lol!~)

I'l also admit that I've never had an issue trying to find a place to "go" here. Could it be because I'm a "girl"?

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 06:48:04 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I'm not "up on it" myself, per se... (4.00 / 1)

I don't know what goes into the decision, how they're funded, etc...

But I do know (I lived within sneezing distance of NYC for most of the first 27 years of my life...) that I've never been to any other City where it was, as Eddie C said, a privilege to use the toilet.

I remember many times over the years, going into a friggin' McDonald's or something somewhere in Manhattan and buying the cheapest thing on the menu just so I could get a key to use the bathroom.  That shouldn't be a memorable part of your experience in one of the greatest cities in the world...

Off hand, I can think of at least 5 public restrooms just in our relatively small Downtown core here in Portland, and these are restrooms you would actually want to use.  Even outside of downtown - clean restrooms in every park, facilities are always available at every neighborhood farmers market, etc...

San Francisco has many public restrooms as well, and if I remember correctly from my very brief time living in Oakland in 2007, they require a quarter deposit (I think you get it back?) - Toronto has the same system, as do many others.

But whatever the cost, I've got to imagine it's pretty negligible overall - and since it is a natural human bodily function, it's inevitably going to lead to problems when you tell people they can't do it by not providing basic public amenities.  Unless you want people to start using alleyways and other public places...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 07:01:40 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I lived in SF for years before here (4.00 / 1)

and I honestly don't remember the bathroom situation. But I seem to think I have always grown up/lived around "Bathrooms are for customers only" type of places. Gas stations are the only thing I can think of as remaining the "best option" for the longest time. I'm sure that's not the case anymore?

Since it seems to be a funding/quality of life (safe/clean enough to piss in quality of life!) vs volume, you would think there is a simple solution, lol!~ It's really not THAT hard!!

Around me, a lot of the car service guys just go in a bottle and leave it at the curb. Which I prefer to the guy who I kept running into while walking my dog at 3-4AM. He was creepy because he was always facing outwards vs the building! Honestly, if I had a public restroom nearby, I wonder if they would use it. Can't leave the car!

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 08:19:18 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

I remember them on Market... (0.00 / 0)

just as soon as you got up from the BART, and I saw them a few other places in the city as well.

They looked like very large closed newsstands, lol...

But this was August 2007, when i was briefly living just across the Bay in Oakland - so I don't know what the situation was when you were there.

Around me, a lot of the car service guys just go in a bottle and leave it at the curb.

Yeah, but eventually somebody's gotta come around and pick those bottles up.  And somebody's gotta deal with them at the recycling plant, and etc...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 08:33:55 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

It's been about 20yrs :) (4.00 / 1)

I also used to live in Oakland.

Yeah, they have to clean up the bottles, but it's better than half naked man flashing you! I swear it took me a couple nights to figure it out. If he had been facing the building, non-issue. But facing away from the building?! And multiple run ins with me being "single female living in big city", your internal alarm goes off. I was actually getting ready to report him. The cops in the 'hood place notices at buildings and businesses if we need to take extra care watching our back and this guy was really walking that line with me. It wasn't blatantly obvious what he was doing . . .  . especially if you've had run ins with half naked guys on the street that were of a sexual nature! What's odd is, the car service "office" is around the corner from me. Why they can't lock their car and take a "real" bathroom break is beyond me . . .  

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 08:50:20 AM UTC

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Heh... (0.00 / 0)

Sorry that you had to deal with that.

Maybe you should have reported that person.  The least they could do is cover up, jeez...

Okay yeah, things were probably different in SF in the 80's.

:)

My time in Oakland, I was living on the waterfront in Jack London Square.  I know for sure that it was very different there 20 years before that!

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 08:57:02 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

It's generally no big deal (4.00 / 1)

like I said, if he had been facing the other way . . . I think I'm also a tad comfortable here. Across the street from a public school no less! And my dog at my side. The cops know me for my late night walks. The other night, one unit slowed down almost to a stop because they saw my dog not me, once they saw me, they went back to their usual "slow patrol until I go in" :)

In hindsight, prob better I didn't report him. Sex Offender sticker isn't something I would want to tag a non-offender. He just seemed really clueless. And prob wasn't expecting me to keep showing up at that hour. And my dog was def an issue with him. She's just big enough  ;) I still prefer pee in a bottle though, lol!~ No need wondering about half naked man at 3AM!

My Oakland time was in the hills. I was in college with a few roommates. Nice up there, but I think my old place burned down in the fires. Jack London Square, haven't heard that reference in AGES!!!  

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by: nycstray @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 09:11:44 AM UTC

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Probably not worth hearing these days... :) (0.00 / 0)

Jack London Square's a mall these days, basically.

Bah.

I was looking for a place in Lake Merritt while I was there, but in the end I decided to head back up here to Portland again instead.  And now once again, I'm looking towards finding a place in Lake Merritt sometime soon...

:)

I'll make it back down there eventually.  I'm gonna retire somewhere in the Bay Area...

Old Oakland is awesome, too.  Chinatown.  The farmers market.  Shit, I'd take Fruitvale over Jack Oakland Square next time...

"The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks." - Christopher Hitchens

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by: JayinPortland @ Sun Mar 08, 2009 at 09:23:12 AM UTC

[ Parent ]